Stunts in combat - how to assess « Thread Started on Jan 25, 2008, 5:13am »
Now that i've been GMing T&T for a whole 6 sessions or so, i have settled upon the following treatments for combat activity (leaving aside magic)
1) Positioning party order/placement on a monster so long as someone is in the monsters face ,party members that wish to try to deliver damage from a less risky vantage point (under chairs/dancing behind the mummies back/flying out of reach) will generally just be able to say thats what they are doing, and receive a lower share of damage distributed. No save will be strictly necessary, most of the time.
2) Maneuvering for tactical advantage jumping on a table, flanking a monster, making them fight through a doorway - a save may be required , and a fumble (3!) or failure will have adverse consequences, but normally only a reduction in combat bonuses applied. Success will mean extra dice or adds for the combat. Example An inspiring song might give bonuses to party morale and combat, a failure may distract them with its whiny drone and reduce adds.
3) Deadly strike stunts trying to backstab, gut, hamstring, eye gouge, tie a monsters shoelaces etc high risk, high outcome success means all the damage will come directly off the monsters Con/Mr (less armour) , may handicap them in other ways and the blow also counts for the combat total. Failure (and especially, fumble) can have lethal consequences.
Is this framework helpful to others? What other ways of applying stunts have creative GM's come up with ?
Joined: Dec 2005 Gender: Male Posts: 593 Location: Right behind you... Karma: 20
Re: Stunts in combat - how to assess « Reply #1 on Jan 26, 2008, 3:55am »
I have always eyeballed it myself-but those (broad) categories might be useful in the future.
Sadly, I don't think there will EVER be charts for:
Launching a Platemail-armored and Two-hatchet wielding Hobbit out of a Trebuchet and into a Giant... Launching barrels of Hundred-year-old Brandy from a Trebuchet and exploding them with Blasting Power in midair (who needs a Dragon?)... Three separate castings of Little Feets and three separate castings of Vorpal Blade(yes there were two Wizards and four Rogues present) which effectively turned the Greataxe-wielding Warrior into the Tasmanian Devil for a round... Using a protesting, bound Goblin as a Shield (fantastic AR until it stops moving!)... Juggling Shuriken to distract a Troll while the Birthday Clown backstabs it with a Scythe, then speed-throwing all the Shuriken into the Troll's face at once... Interrogating the Necromancer with a Seige Weapon( "Does an Arbalest HAVE a Safety? Do you REALLY want to know?")... Casting Zombie Zonk on the dead Medusa, giving it a loud shirt so that Monsters will be drawn to stare and sending it ahead to "soften up" the Dungeon... Pretending to be "Official Dungeon Inspectors"... Using a Curse You spell to target a Monster's SPD instead of MR("Of course it has Speed, how else could it be CHASING us?")... Dropping Candy laced with Hellbore Juice to both distract and poison pursuing Monsters... Loading up the Leprechaun with the biggest barrel of Gunpowder they can find and having it Wink-wing into the enemy encampment, light fuse and Wink-wing back out... Casting Zombie Zonk on the Enemy Commander (slain in combat earlier) and marching it into the Enemy encampment wearing women's lingerie and lipstick to "demoralize the Troops"... Replacing the Archmage's Deluxe Staff with a cunningly-fashioned replica, containing a small core of Meteoric Iron inside... Filling a Wicker Man with enemy corpses, casting Zombie Zonk on the whole mess, set the thing on fire and have it march on the castle(with the PCs in the forefront screaming "The Great Volcano God demands the Surrender of Castle Burliegh!!!")... Setting a whole swarm of Rats aglow with Wil-o-wisp spells and making the sleepy hamlet evacuate the "fast approaching army-can you not SEE all those torches?".
My Players, Lords and Ladies...Chaos Theory made manifest! Chart those idiots if you can...
Joined: Nov 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 614 Karma: 16
Re: Stunts in combat - how to assess « Reply #4 on Jan 26, 2008, 11:35am »
Quote:
Three separate castings of Little Feets and three separate castings of Vorpal Blade(yes there were two Wizards and four Rogues present) which effectively turned the Greataxe-wielding Warrior into the Tasmanian Devil for a round...
All kidding aside for a moment, do you seriously allow "spell-stacking"?
Joined: Dec 2005 Gender: Male Posts: 593 Location: Right behind you... Karma: 20
Re: Stunts in combat - how to assess « Reply #5 on Jan 26, 2008, 12:10pm »
I Houseruled it out when we started a new game, but They Got Me that time! On the Flip side, I don't allow Curse Stacking anymore either-if Bob Curses Dave's Dex by 5 and then Lisa Curses the same Ability for 6, Bob is at -6 to DEX. Bob and Lisa can target seperate stats though, and Dave can be at -5 IQ and -6 DEX...it was just embarrassing when the gang got the drop on an Undead Archmage and Cursed his IQ to 6, not only did all his spellcasting powers immediately disappear but he started talking like the Hulk ("what for you do that to Al'hrain? Look, pretty butterfly!")...
The Main Rule at all my games: If the Players spot a Rules Exploit, then by all means use it! Keeps me on my GM toes, lets me fine-tune my game next time and lets the PCs high five each other if they stump me....how do you think I developed my rules-editing Spidey-sense? And remember folks, in Monsters! Monsters! all non-monsters(humans, Hobbits etc.) over 4th Level( all Types) walk around Unarmed because they can do 1D6 damage per Level!! (P.39, par.3) HAAAIII!!!!! YAAAHHH!!!! KIIIAAAII!!!!
Joined: Nov 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 614 Karma: 16
Re: Stunts in combat - how to assess « Reply #6 on Jan 26, 2008, 12:36pm »
Quote:
I Houseruled it out when we started a new game, but They Got Me that time! The Main Rule at all my games: If the Players spot a Rules Exploit, then by all means use it!
I don't recall anywhere in the rules where spells were stacked... unless I just don't remember but it's there, then I'm guessing that spell-stacking is based on interpretation (although it's probably been answered definitively in an SA... Stackpole used to love to do that).
I just never considered it, honestly. I'm pretty sure someone tried it in the first or second game we ever played, and me or whoever was GMing looked at it, tried to find something in the rules, couldn't find anything, said "let's think about this for a sec.," talked it over, decided it didn't make any sense, and said, "Nah, I'm pretty sure you can't cast spells on top of one another and have them all work together." To my mind, stacking spells wouldn't be as much an exploit as a misinterpretation... but I guess that's all based on your interpretation! Like I always say, "there's no one definitive way to do anything in rpgs... or, at least, there shouldn't be!"
Joined: Dec 2005 Gender: Male Posts: 593 Location: Right behind you... Karma: 20
Re: Stunts in combat - how to assess « Reply #7 on Jan 27, 2008, 2:12am »
Exactly...it doesn't say that spells stack, and it doesn't say they don't! I never expected to have enough Magic firepower available at once for the PCs to try a Buff of that magnitude-but they did. They made a good case for it, I declared an Official "what the heck" Moment, and then one round later we all fell off our chairs laughing and I declared an official Rules Patch.
Next game, they tried it again and it fizzled-as we all agreed it should. The party Wizard muttered about Planetary Alignments and Odd Magic Zones and we continued the game...and that's how our Houserules develop.
Houserule 22 (multi-genre Regional)-'Enhancements and Curses don't stack, use the best result. Zappathingum is better than Vorpal for a reason'. I place it between Houserule 21 (Most Genres)-'Hobbits are not KAWAII, nor are they CHIBI, nor do they speak like Pokemon!' and Houserule 23 (Multi-genre)-'stop aping The Princess Bride, it is no longer clever'.
I can't wait until somebody ELSE GMs a game, the new GM has to make thier version from scratch! Keeps games fresh-besides, it's MY turn to mke a GM choke on his/her beverage...
Joined: Nov 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 614 Karma: 16
Re: Stunts in combat - how to assess « Reply #9 on Jan 27, 2008, 11:26am »
Quote:
Next game, they tried it again and it fizzled-as we all agreed it should. The party Wizard muttered about Planetary Alignments and Odd Magic Zones and we continued the game...and that's how our Houserules develop.
That's cool... that's how mine have always developed, as well, and I think that's the best way: In actual play, as new things are tried, and the group determines the tone and style of the game.
One of my campaign worlds have been running a long time, and it does have a pre-set number of House Rules that define it. Changing those now would make it seem odd... like a totally different world, as things that used to work a certain way suddenly don't anymore.
And there are certain worlds where I would start with a number of pre-set assumptions, and I think I have enough history with the game now to know how things work... I might tweak some things before play to configure the mechanics to the setting.
But, by and large, changes happen in play. And with T&T, something else I've learned is not to be too quick on those House Rules... just because you did it one way one time doesn't necessarily set a precedent! Quoting the 5e rulebook (from memory!), "Keep it loose, and if the rules don't conform to a situation, warp the rules... not the situation."
Joined: Dec 2005 Gender: Male Posts: 593 Location: Right behind you... Karma: 20
Re: Stunts in combat - how to assess « Reply #10 on Jan 28, 2008, 12:04am »
Sadly Troll66, I think my answers to your questions will only lead to more questions...
1) IMO, a Stunt requires at least a Lvl 1 SR...going by a previous example: turning a pile of corpses and some wicker into the Burning Man Concert was quite a stunt, but not a Stunt...convincing the holders of Castle Burleigh that the Volcano God wants the castle was a CHA SR and therefore a Stunt. Admittedly, having a 25-foot tall hibachi doing the Robot outside the gates gave them some GREAT bonuses!
2) I allow a Stunt anytime just before I roll the Hit Totals-this is usually accompanied by those famous words "I Have..A Cunning..Plan" and the GM visably flinching.
Exceptions prove the rule however-one of ny Players read of "Burning Armor" in 4th edition(Warriors can sacrifice Armor/Shields for a massive but temporary boost in protection in Melee) and thought it would make a cool Stunt-oddly enough, such an action would violate both (1) and(2)...it would not need an SR and would be most effective after the HPT was calculated! Go figure.
Re: Stunts in combat - how to assess « Reply #12 on Jan 28, 2008, 5:40am »
Some really great examples of delver ingenuity order99, definitely worth an exalt.
I agree that in general its a stunt if it needs a save - but as i laid out above there are easily achievable actions which will have an effect on combat; and different ways of having stunts affect a combat.
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And remember folks, in Monsters! Monsters! all non-monsters(humans, Hobbits etc.) over 4th Level( all Types) walk around Unarmed because they can do 1D6 damage per Level!! (P.39, par.3) HAAAIII!!!!! YAAAHHH!!!! KIIIAAAII!!!! 
