OK, I have to play Devil's Advocate a bit on this one.
Was T&T (or any of those other games for that matter) ever really generic? T&T has black powder fire arms. I don't remember those from Earthsea, Tekumel, Krynn, Middle Earth etc.
I have always associated T&T with Trollworld, while recognizing that it plays well in other settings too.
Kremm vs Kremm could be narrated as spell vs counterspell, or Pow vs Pow struggles (for any RQ fans out there).
Remember Gandalf at Balin's tomb, "I sensed a Power greater than any I have felt before. The counter-spell was so strong it nearly broke me."
I am glad to see that casting spells at those of higher Kremm does at least lower the target's Wiz, although I would like to see a SR to allow the spell some chance of working.
Liz Danforth's "Imp-Possible Situations" in "Mage-blood and Old Bones" features a character who is able to disrupt magic cast at or around her. So there is precedent of a sort.
I don't think the new rules render T&T any more or less generic than older rules did. Every fantasy game makes assumptions in its core mechanics about how the world works, including technology, magic, the gods, kindreds etc. These may or may not match the assumptions made by the creator of a particular fantasy world.
Post by Vin Ahrr Vin on Mar 16, 2008 21:20:34 GMT -5
I played T&T long before I realized that there was an official "Trollworld", so the game has always seemed pretty generic to me. It's the same as with OD&D, where the rules are a general guideline as to how to make up your own world rather than a way to run someone else's pre-generated world. Maybe that's just me.
Vin Ahrr Vin Discovered T&T in 2003, Keeper of the TrollBridge Since 2005 OD&D Player since 1975
“Please feel free....to modify and improve these basic rules as your imagination dictates to be right for you." - Ken St.Andre, T&T 1E, 1976.
“Do not fail to notice [that] Vin's The Muad’Dib of T&T” - Ragnorakk
Post by lionrampant on Mar 18, 2008 7:39:55 GMT -5
If I remember right, there was a blurg in the 5th edition rulebook that basically said that Ken's games take place in Trollworld, and the assumption is that everybody else's game takes place in an alternate dimension, but that there are dimensional gates that allow passage from one world to the next. Thus, a character could play in an official Flying Buffalo solitaire adventure, such as Arena of Thyatis, and then show up in a GM game set in a different setting, and it was all officially "OK."
If I remember right, there was a blurg in the 5th edition rulebook that basically said that Ken's games take place in Trollworld, and the assumption is that everybody else's game takes place in an alternate dimension, but that there are dimensional gates that allow passage from one world to the next.
I think the text you're referring to is :
When your characters have gone through a few dungeon trips and have developed a sense of "realness", you may start asking yourself these questions, and others besides. In Phoenix we certainly did, and a whole world has grown out as a consequence. Some of the comments below refer to this world we have jointly created, but do not assume you must play in this world and no other. (If you want to come in, you're welcome-- the continent of Rhalph has countless dimensional doorways for you to pass through). But we cannot urge you strongly enough to exercise your wit and imagination (as well as your time, energy and maybe a little cash) in creating an environment of your own people, places and things. (from 3.1 More About City, World & Dungeon Building)
If that's not it, if you can give me a bit more I'm sure I can dig it up. Thanks!
Post by Aramis of Erak on Jul 22, 2009 18:08:05 GMT -5
T&T is as generic as any RPG not inherently designed for modularity...
The setting assumptions built into the rules themselves (ignoring all the setting materials): 1) There is a wizards guild 2) being a wizard requires extensive training 3) Being a warrior is about maximizing the use of your armor, and that is a hard learned skill. 4) Priests do not wield any particular distinctive magic 5) almost all capabilities can be built up with use. 6) Wizards are inept at swordwork, but a potentially lethal with knives and staffs.
Some implications of the magic system are that: 1) slaves may be magically bound 2) Stone blocks are manufactured easily in mountains (read the slush-yuck spell carefully!) 3) digging out underground dwellings is fairly easy. (Again, slush-yuck) 4) cheap "fake wands" are available... they provide sufficient light to navigate by....
~Wil -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface! aramis.hostman.us/
Post by hrrrothgarrr on Jul 29, 2009 11:30:37 GMT -5
I will add a further couple of assumptions built into the rules.
5) Rouge Wizards who have the talent for magic but not the training exist. 6) Rare individuals who can exploit both magic and arms exist. 7) Any creature of sufficient inteligence is a potential "citizen". 8) Many such creatures exist, not all of the humanoid.
7&8 are a huge departure from the default setting assumption of most RPGs which divides all creatures into Neutral (animals), Good (certain humanoids) and Evil or Monsters (everything else in the world).
In most RPG settings orcs, trolls, etc are "Monsters" and there for exist only to be killed. They are never going to be accepted as "citizens" in any civilized area. The best they can hope for is enslavement rather than extermination.
I can still remember the shock on my player's faces when they firts realized that someof the "monsters" they had slain in the local dungeon were highly regared citizens of the city above.
T&T is still generic in my mind. You can change all those bits and pieces without impacting greatly on play. You can add your own 'world specific' details with incredible ease, making it your own. You can play T&T cthulhu, post-apocolyptic, supers, anything.
Post by hrrrothgarrr on Jul 30, 2009 6:36:16 GMT -5
Considering that I am thinking of incorporating large slices of "Labyrinth" into the T&T game I am running for my daughter, and have used Greek and Germanic mythology on other occassions. And that the basic mechanisms work well for non-fantasy genres without a lot of conversion work, MR is MR, dragon or space amoeba doesn't matter.
I would vote for T&T is certainly flexible if not generic as well.
T&T is not what I would call a "Generic" game, Backgammon, Chess and Yahtzee are good illustrations of Generic games. T&T needs a setting, yours, mine, Ken's or Hoggies it needs more than just a board/table and dice/moves.
So T&T was never generic, so it can't still be Does the writer mean is T&T 7 still free of the requirements of an "Official" setting, then it most certainly is. Anyone can use the rules As Is and set it into their own settings. V4 & 5 are more suited to this than v 7 but it is still a trivial matter. So YES T&T is Still "Generic"