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Post by grrraall on Sept 10, 2012 12:53:45 GMT -5
When I read Terry Pratchett's "The Color of Magic", I thought Discworld would make a marvelous setting for T&T. The only problem, which will be found in the back of his books, is "There are no maps, you can't map a sense of humor". grrraall, I wonder if a module/setting like Keep on the Boarderlands (Zendog mentioned it above) wouldn't appeal to your French audience. It's kind of the best of both worlds. It's a small setting in a broader world that is easily expandable. It would need a little more history added to it, but each GM could make it his own. There are lots of good settings on the market, and obviously, T&T players all around the world use them, at least from time to time. Still, I'd like to have a T&T-specific setting - One that catches the Tunnels & Trolls mood/spirit/atmosphere/approach/je-ne-sais-quoi... And one that would preferably be produced by Flying Buffalo, with the T&T team: Liz Danforth, Ken St. Andre, Bear Peters, Steve Crompton, etc. That could be fun, that could be great! ;D
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Post by grrraall on Sept 10, 2012 12:57:40 GMT -5
I think the game lacks support - a unified game world with a series ('adventure path'?) of connected adventures and unified look to the modules would elevate the game to something more than 'indie' status. For me, it's what separates 'Indie' and small press games from professional looking products. You get a rulebook, and that's it as far as T&T goes. I've got all the Corgi solos and they play like Fighting Fantasy, which is fine, but not supporting the game in a traditional RPG sense that explores a section of a continent with history, politics, legends and adventure ideas. Sure, it'd be similar/copying the Basic/Expert D&D way of doing things, but that's not a bad thing. So for Trollworld to grow, a single map, then a series of linked 3 part adventures. Get a single artist to do the cover, innards and have a unified layout. It's a gamble (costing time and effort) but churning out a new edition of the rules every few years feels like rebooting the game with a 'the new edition is better than the old, buy it!'. Sure, but what do you do with it? Help us along here Ken, or Flying Buffalo or whomever. I couldn't agree more. Have an exalt!
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Post by feldrik on Sept 10, 2012 17:23:17 GMT -5
I can appreciate what Mr.St Andre is driving at by eschewing an officialnsetting...everyone is to dig deepnand be creative.A '
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Post by feldrik on Sept 10, 2012 17:41:39 GMT -5
I can appreciate what Mr.St Andre is driving at by eschewing an official setting...everyone is to dig deep and be creative.An 'official' setting does,however, help new and veteran players find a common ground to start their imaginations running. When a new player looks at a game system the setting gives a certain life to what would otherwise be a text book. I think the best example of a game that hits the sweet spot T&T should shoot for is Barbarians of Lemuria. A paragraph or two about the major cities and geogrphical features, perhaps a note or two about plot hooks and nearby historically significant places (I.e. the published GM and solo adventures) and that is all you need to give the rules a life and epicenter for gamers to start from. It would be very helpful, in my never to be humble opinion, in giving the game legs to carry it onward for several more decades.
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derv
4th Level Troll
Posts: 335
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Post by derv on Sept 10, 2012 18:39:06 GMT -5
I can appreciate what Mr.St Andre is driving at by eschewing an officialnsetting...everyone is to dig deepnand be creative.A ' Well, I was just perusing over on Dekh's T&T site and watched an interview with Ken at Gencon on The Spiel. It was basically Ken going over the origins of T&T. What occurred to me while I watched it was Ken's unique perspective to Roleplaying. He didn't understand OD&D, so he made his own game. He didn't have a list of races, spells, or monsters. He and his friends made them up. He wasn't playing in a preset setting. His group were making it up as they went along. He was doing this at the very beginning of the hobby. Maybe Ken wants us to experience T&T like he did. Here we are in the post-innovation of roleplaying games, expecting the designers to do it for us and this just wasn't his experience. His experience and expectations were very different-an old school take the bull by the horns approach. This is all speculation and hyperbole on my part though .
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Post by Aramis of Erak on Sept 10, 2012 19:49:03 GMT -5
Derv - Ken's said as much in various interviews.
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derv
4th Level Troll
Posts: 335
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Post by derv on Sept 10, 2012 20:25:24 GMT -5
Derv - Ken's said as much in various interviews. yes, it seems so. I was just wondering if any one was hearing it for what it was?
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zendog
4th Level Troll
Posts: 250
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Post by zendog on Sept 10, 2012 23:49:20 GMT -5
Derv - Ken's said as much in various interviews. yes, it seems so. I was just wondering if any one was hearing it for what it was? Hearing it loud and clear thanks. I've always made my own settings, adventures, and even my own rules. Have done since I started in the hobby. What Ken says matches what Gygax used to say. He couldn't understand why people were writing and asking for rules clarifications, and why they wanted published dungeons and campaign worlds. To him creating that stuff was a major part of the fun of the game. And I agree. However, that doesn't change the fact that many people just aren't that creative, or simply don't have the time or energy, to write up an entire setting, or just like published setting,, and that T&T would be well served by having a polished and published setting. Ideally as grrraall said, published by FBI. It would, I think, be good for the game.
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derv
4th Level Troll
Posts: 335
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Post by derv on Sept 11, 2012 19:10:44 GMT -5
zendog, what I meant by, "hearing it for what it was", is that it seems pretty final, being based on Ken's basic ideology of the game. Any expectations of an official setting seems like an exercise in futility. Would it be nice, yes. I enjoy reading Ken's and others musings on things like Rhalf, Kindreds, and the history of Trollworld. Will it happen, I'd be plesently surprised if it did, but I'm not holding my breath and it has no bearing on whether I play or not. I guess the reason I wrote the OP, in the first place, is because it seems like I'm frequently hearing complaints about the support to T&T and I was trying to understand that point of view. The setting issue seems to be at the center of it, as well as no PDF of the 5th ed. rules. I personally never used alot of support material in my games, but I can understand your point about people not having the time, energy or creativity and wanting something official.
Now, a company running out of the official rulebook with no plans to replenish them for a years time, or bridge the gap until a new edition comes into being, is an odd thing and I can understand that frustration. But, for the most part, that wasn't really mentioned. To me, the rule book and collaboration with other players is how you grow the game though.
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Post by thorswulf on Sept 13, 2012 18:53:50 GMT -5
I confess: I'm a map junkie when it comes to fantasy worlds. A good map sets the mood and tone of a fantasy world for me. Excellent cartography isn't necessarily a must, as maps tend to vary quite a bit. Trollworld and the continent of Ralph speaks volumes to me. It says, "Here's a world of magic and wonder that doesn't take itself toooo seriously at times...".
I was looking at the map that was posted at Trollhalla, and I think the Trollgod is right: There is quite a bit in the middle of the map that you could do cool stuff with. In particular I was drawn to islands that form the dragon's wings and spine area. I instantly called it the DragonSpine sea. I visualized lizard men pirates, viking types mixed with pacific islanders for a really unusual culture, tritons living in coral castles, sea elves that live in massive kelp net-like villages, orc pirates ala the piratical brotherhoods of popular fiction, Kraken men, and so on. The sea itself could be like that of the middle and northern Pacific, temperate but prone to violent storms.
Well, I hope you understand what I'm getting at. A fixed setting is nice, but a map can be all you really need in my opinion. Yes, I too would love a map of Khazan....
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derv
4th Level Troll
Posts: 335
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Post by derv on Sept 14, 2012 17:05:08 GMT -5
you have some good ideas there thorswulf. sounds like a fun setting to adventure in.
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Post by thorswulf on Sept 14, 2012 18:30:44 GMT -5
Well to be perfectly honest I started with a purely viking type setting. The geography of Ralph being what it is, makes it seem like the further away from the spine you go the colder it would get. I have to admit I like many of the cultures from the various Pacific island countries. Not only that but prahus (native ocean going boats) vs. longships is just too much of a temptation!
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Post by feldrik on Sept 14, 2012 19:05:32 GMT -5
I adore maps too. I have simply used the Dragon Head and the bit I know about the places. I would not like a lot of detail in any gazeteer type publication. I prefer earthy, gritty, low magic type adventures while the author may be all about high magic and other wild stuff. I guess that is about as official as we need, a world is a big place and we can all fit in it easily.
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gwindel
4th Level Troll
-Spirituality is a crime against Humanity-
Posts: 252
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Post by gwindel on Sept 15, 2012 6:13:13 GMT -5
I love when description of places are not overdetailed. As long as it is generic, it opens places that you can fit in your campaign. When you have overdetailed locations up to the stats of NPCs, it closes the place for your own stuff.
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apn
5th Level Troll
Posts: 578
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Post by apn on Sept 16, 2012 7:45:33 GMT -5
What about a Trollbridge project, like a thread or wiki where people can dip in and add places to a map? Towns, cities, baronies, kingdoms, empires... No time limit, just add as you go?
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