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Post by zanshin on Mar 22, 2023 8:22:47 GMT -5
Just to say that if anyone wants a we transfer of the latest Trollszines please pm me with your email address.
Singularly unimpressed.
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mosker
5th Level Troll
Posts: 530
Member is Online
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Post by mosker on Mar 22, 2023 9:07:12 GMT -5
Comforting to have adults on the bridge. My thoughts in words would crash the auto-filters. I hope the publishers and creators are talking to one another (the last thing I did was the semi-regular e-Newsletter w/Ken in the KS days) or has anyone reached out to the press Linda Codega, Enworld, Tenkar? What we're seeing here is a significantly scaled down--but I believe the analogy holds to a great extent--version what was feared in the OGL space.
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Post by ProfGremlin on Mar 22, 2023 10:19:38 GMT -5
Completely agree. I've always striven to be a voice of reason and calm here on the 'Bridge, someone of service to the community. That community still exists. The reasonable discourse within this very thread is evidence of that. T&T has grown in our little corner of the hobby due in no small part to the esteem the community has held for KSA and the Fellowship and their involvement with the community. Webbed Sphere has done nothing that I can see to make themselves members of the community. Their lack of communication with the community - they know where the 'Bridge is and have posted to it ( okgamer , Last Online: Apr 6, 2022 at 8:48am really?! a year ago?!) - to my mind highlights exactly where we are in their list of priorities. Sure, they had a setback with GenCon (Was that the right con?) and a lost shipment of product. Life happens. But to say nothing to the fans hoping to see them? Not even a notice at their resulting empty booth space? We didn't find out the truth until a blogger started asking questions and went digging. Webbed Sphere hasn't even added a link for T&T, or FBI, to their subsidiary Troll and Toad, an online presence for CCGs. And now they're pulling third-party T&T products off the shelves without notifying them ahead of time? Now compare that to the communication sscrompton has provided regarding the direction he and KSA are taking for their new vision, Monsters! Monsters! I think WS's silence has spoken volumes. I would tend to agree with earlier statements that it would seem the best decision for third party publishers is to pivot and update their offerings for M!M! Steve and Ken have already put out the call to build relationships with third-party creators, Huge News about Monsters! Monsters! 2023 I have to wonder just what would meed to go in to the appendix of a M!M! supplement to provide a conversion to T&T.
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Post by houndle on Mar 22, 2023 11:55:11 GMT -5
just what would meed to go in to the appendix of a M!M! supplement to provide a conversion to T&T. From a practical point of view, I would say very little. The material already published for M!M! (solos and so forth) has a high degree of compatibility with T&T. There's a long standing tradition of bolting house rules on to the core system, and even if my copy of dT&T was snatched away (and trust me, I've backed up all my stuff since this came to light) I'd probably be able to reconfigure existing T&T supplements to the M!M! rules without too much trouble. I'm sure most of us could do the same. It would be an annoyance but I doubt that there are many in our little community who don't constantly tinker with rules. I suspect that, for historic reasons T&T currently has more "brand awareness" than M!M! right now, but it's encouraging that the M!M! content creators are working hard to address that. Just to clarify the current position - are we saying that some of the (paid for) material on DTRPG is no longer accessible? I've just lost a few things I had previously downloaded when the device it was stored on crashed. If that means I can no longer get at things I've actually paid for I will be most displeased.
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viva
3rd Level Troll
Posts: 109
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Post by viva on Mar 22, 2023 15:51:53 GMT -5
Just to clarify the current position - are we saying that some of the (paid for) material on DTRPG is no longer accessible? I've just lost a few things I had previously downloaded when the device it was stored on crashed. If that means I can no longer get at things I've actually paid for I will be most displeased. I can still download things purchased before they were removed. It is the general searches (to be able to browse/buy) that are dropping like flies. Very unfortunate turn of events and my positive attitude is...no longer positive.
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Post by mahrundl on Mar 22, 2023 19:54:23 GMT -5
Anything previously purchased should be OK. You paid for the product from a legitimate seller, and own it (and the PDFs have your name and a serial number watermarked on them). New sales won't happen now that the products have been removed from the shelves, but there is no reason that you should be denied access to anything that you already own.
I have no idea if anyone will try to remove access to existing products, but I think they'd be in for a sizable backlash if they tried.
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dungeondevil
3rd Level Troll
Give me grain and I'll give you guns!
Posts: 174
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Post by dungeondevil on Mar 23, 2023 0:47:43 GMT -5
I just checked my Drivethru library and everything T&T-related is still there and available for DL. How long that will last is anyone's guess.
I think WS is gonna have to step up and do some important PR work to keep any stirrings of discontent to a minimum, otherwise they may have to deal with some serious resentment from the consumer-base. Just my 2 copper pieces.
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tenkar
1st Level Troll
Posts: 12
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Post by tenkar on Mar 24, 2023 10:53:59 GMT -5
I was pinged this morning about this topic on The Tavern's Discord Server. It's the first I've heard of it but in truth, I'm not surprised. The communication over the future of T&T from its new owners has been severely lacking.
I'm happy to cover this situation (not happy WITH the situation, obviously), as I've been a T&T fan for years.
If folks can fill me in with some more details (if available) and a verbatim notification received by OBS or Webbed Sphere, I'd be in your dept.
Tenkar
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darrght
4th Level Troll
Wow, I'm a 4th Level Troll!
Posts: 441
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Post by darrght on Mar 28, 2023 17:16:21 GMT -5
Well my friends, with the likelihood that we at TavernMaster Games will not be able to publish anything with the T&T label on it for the foreseeable future, I am proud to announce our first venture into the realms of Monsters! Monsters! Thank you so much Steve C and The TrollGod himself for continueing to encourage our creativity with this versatile and fun rules set. The Skyship of Lord Orink started out life as a T&T product but with some nifty pdf editing, it is now Monsters! Monsters! compatible and available at DriveThru here:- The Skyship of Lord Orink It has a fantastic Jeff Freels cover and is 165 paragraphs of roleplaying fun Future projects will, undoubtedly, involve exploring the Zimrala setting but for now, enjoy more derring do on the world of Talsus
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viva
3rd Level Troll
Posts: 109
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Post by viva on Mar 28, 2023 20:45:57 GMT -5
Congrats, Sid (and TMG)!
Now my T&T playtester version is a real collectible...Going straight to eBay ! ! !
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mosker
5th Level Troll
Posts: 530
Member is Online
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Post by mosker on Mar 28, 2023 21:25:50 GMT -5
Congrats, Sid (and TMG)! Now my T&T playtester version is a real collectible...Going straight to eBay ! ! ! I want a meaningless certificate of authenticity if you expect me to bid.
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darrght
4th Level Troll
Wow, I'm a 4th Level Troll!
Posts: 441
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Post by darrght on Mar 29, 2023 4:05:06 GMT -5
Congrats, Sid (and TMG)! Now my T&T playtester version is a real collectible...Going straight to eBay ! ! ! Make sure I gave you a playtester credit viva , now I have a pdf editor, it's easy to make alterations to the text
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darrght
4th Level Troll
Wow, I'm a 4th Level Troll!
Posts: 441
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Post by darrght on Mar 29, 2023 4:32:42 GMT -5
Just to say that if anyone wants a we transfer of the latest Trollszines please pm me with your email address. Singularly unimpressed. Sadly zanshin , it appears that in order to avoid the wrath of WS, all reference to T&T and specific features of the rules must be removed from available material on DriveThru. For specific small products removing/editing these references isn't too challenging a task, though it is laborious in the extreme . I think the only way to keep all editions of Trollszine available on DriveThru will be to talk directly to Ed Bryan at WS and try to get some sort of special dispensation for a Fanzine of such awesome quality . The TavernMasters would, of course, be happy to host on our little bit of DTRPG . Had a thought that we could do a standard email begging for a Trollszine exemption and then we could all send it to Ed. This would either demonstrate the strength of feeling and get them to do so, or it might fill this chap's inbox and completely pi$$ him off Do you and quoghmyre have other plans afoot?
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mosker
5th Level Troll
Posts: 530
Member is Online
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Post by mosker on Mar 29, 2023 8:43:09 GMT -5
"The Skyship of Lord Orink Note: Thank you for buying this solitaire adventure from Tavernmaster Games.
Please take a look at our other Tunnels & Trolls products at DriveThru RPG.
Regards
The Tavernmaster Crew"[Underline mine]
Viva la Trollresistance!
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Post by zanshin on Mar 29, 2023 16:04:34 GMT -5
Yes, I don't think it's feasible to retool existing Trollszines given the basis on which we agreed use with contributors.
A nuclear option is to withdraw permission for Trollszines 1-3, 10 & 11 (Dan Hembree was the leading light for 4-8) but that feels counterproductive to me.
At the moment this isn't getting my full focus, but it has left me a bit down on it all. Very glad to see Sid getting so organised.
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