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Post by ironfang on Dec 9, 2005 19:45:16 GMT -5
Just be careful not to trample any intellectual property rights if you do a fanzine. per my lawyer... Unless you actually reprint rules/solos/articles which FBI or a licensed third-party has already published (in a format that goes beyond the Fair Use review provisions), putting out a game-related fanzine should not infringe upon the "intellectual property" of the game's copyright holder. One shouldn't use protected logos, etc, without written permission and definitely include a line like... T&T and "Tunnels & Trolls" are registered trademarks of FBI and copyright is held by them and we do not dispute this ...but the concept of a fanzine is generally seen as harmless. If you go "professional" though, consult a qualified attourney. My impression was that fanzines get into the grey area of Fair Use, in that one is supposed to create new adventures and treasures and monsters and so forth, and since this is also designed to be played in a group, there is an implied consent to share your creations.
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Boozer
4th Level Troll
Visit The Hobgoblin's Tavern today!
Posts: 299
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Post by Boozer on Dec 10, 2005 14:28:41 GMT -5
I wouldn't consider doing an on-line fanzine, that's Middleclaw's territory, and far be it from me to try and rival it. I don't have the technology or the skill either! I think Ken would be all for any new T&T fanzine. He has often said that he wants to see more and more T&T material out there, and I wholeheartedly agree.
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Post by Ramsen Triton on Dec 11, 2005 13:03:03 GMT -5
The main problem with selling printed fanzines is finding an outlet for them. I'm sure everyone on Trollhalla would buy one, but that's only about 25 sales. There are probably plenty more T&T fans around the world who would be interested in buying a fanzine, but you'd have to reach out further than Trollhalla or this forum. eBay might be a good idea. That reminds me: Does anyone else think it's criminal that there isn't a proper 'official' Tunnels and Trolls website that's regularly updated, has plenty of content and offers products for sale? Who owns the 'www.tunnelsandtrolls.com' domain - I assume it must be Ken or Rick? Why is it sitting there unused? It's quite telling that this forum already has more members than Trollhalla - an indication that there are plenty of T&T fans out there who are looking for a place to discuss the game, but don't want to have to join an exclusive, pay for access club. Sorry, I'll shut up now, as this seems to be rapidly turning into a rant.
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Post by branderwydd /|\ on Dec 11, 2005 13:23:26 GMT -5
nuff said.
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Post by branderwydd /|\ on Dec 11, 2005 13:25:15 GMT -5
nuff said. what i mean by that, since people have a tendancy to misinterpret things, and even though i'm not a right church-goin' fella, is 'amen brother.'
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Post by ironfang on Dec 12, 2005 19:52:31 GMT -5
eBay would be an excellent starting point. Discounting the obvious resellers/retailers, since I've been tracking eBay sales, I've seen over 250 unique "buyers" of T&T related merchandise.
Getting it into the local game/comic shops would be critical as well, and would have to be partly the responsibility of the Champions of Trollhalla. I've been able to get two of my local shops to stock T&T - admittedly in small quantities. It's not flying off the shelves, but there is turnover, and as 5.5 rulebooks sell, a few more solos get stocked.
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Post by maasenstodt on Dec 12, 2005 20:28:20 GMT -5
Does anyone else think it's criminal that there isn't a proper 'official' Tunnels and Trolls website that's regularly updated, has plenty of content and offers products for sale? Who owns the 'www.tunnelsandtrolls.com' domain - I assume it must be Ken or Rick? Why is it sitting there unused? It's quite telling that this forum already has more members than Trollhalla - an indication that there are plenty of T&T fans out there who are looking for a place to discuss the game, but don't want to have to join an exclusive, pay for access club. Criminal? No. Boneheaded? I think so. Neither FBI's nor Fiery Dragon's T&T sections are very informative or provide much content. Given how much RPG activity is web driven nowadays (heck, I wouldn't own my copy of T&T were it not for the internet and web based forums!), it makes a lot of sense to me to have a site to perform those functions. Likewise, one of the things that kept me away from T&T in the recent past was the exclusivity of the fan base as represented by Trollhalla. The idea that a person has to make payments beyond the product itself to receive much in the way of support or engage in the community around it doesn't strike me as being a part of a good marketing strategy. Then again, perhaps others are attracted to that kind of thing... What do I know?
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Post by skathros on Dec 12, 2005 22:50:26 GMT -5
Likewise, one of the things that kept me away from T&T in the recent past was the exclusivity of the fan base as represented by Trollhalla. The idea that a person has to make payments beyond the product itself to receive much in the way of support or engage in the community around it doesn't strike me as being a part of a good marketing strategy. Now this is something i've been meaning to disscuss. Before getting 7E, my only exposure to anything T&T related was from FBIs site. With my purchase of 7E, i did what i always do with a new RPG or game, i hunted for message boards. I happened upon Trollhalla and was both baffled and disbelieving at first with the "pay to join" aspect. I have never, ever seen any other RPG company do this. This "behind closed doors" aspect might put some off,and in truth, appears to be more of a hinderance to the average Player/GM than anything else. If i had a question and the Trollbridge wasnt around, what would i do? If you limite yourselfe to a "good old boys" club, where to you get your influx of new and fresh ideas? Without new faces, you get the same ideas being bounced around by the same people and the game stagnates. It seems to me that T&T would benefit from things like fan based e-zines (sure, they're not official, sure they're not backed by FBI/KSA, but it adds life into the game! Take, for example, Pinnicle's Savage Worlds. When the game first came out, people were creating stuff left and right. The more people created for the game, the more other fans got excited about the game. Everyone was in creative mode and the buzz was going 'round the net. That's the kind of life T&T needs. Because, in truth, T&T is an awsome system that rightfuly deserves the kind of activity other RPG's enjoy, and i don't see this happening with things like "pay for trollhalla" and worrying about getting sued for a fan-based free e-zine. IMHO, it's time T&T stoped being a cult status RPG. It has the strength to stand poudly with the best of them!
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Post by maasenstodt on Dec 12, 2005 22:56:57 GMT -5
Now this is something i've been meaning to disscuss. Before getting 7E, my only exposure to anything T&T related was from FBIs site. With my purchase of 7E, i did what i always do with a new RPG or game, i hunted for message boards. I happened upon Trollhalla and was both baffled and disbelieving at first with the "pay to join" aspect. I have never, ever seen any other RPG company do this. This "behind closed doors" aspect might put some off,and in truth, appears to be more of a hinderance to the average Player/GM than anything else. If i had a question and the Trollbridge wasnt around, what would i do? If you limite yourselfe to a "good old boys" club, where to you get your influx of new and fresh ideas? Without new faces, you get the same ideas being bounced around by the same people and the game stagnates. It seems to me that T&T would benefit from things like fan based e-zines (sure, they're not official, sure they're not backed by FBI/KSA, but it adds life into the game! Take, for example, Pinnicle's Savage Worlds. When the game first came out, people were creating stuff left and right. The more people created for the game, the more other fans got excited about the game. Everyone was in creative mode and the buzz was going 'round the net. That's the kind of life T&T needs. Because, in truth, T&T is an awsome system that rightfuly deserves the kind of activity other RPG's enjoy, and i don't see this happening with things like "pay for trollhalla" and worrying about getting sued for a fan-based free e-zine. IMHO, it's time T&T stoped being a cult status RPG. It has the strength to stand poudly with the best of them! Well stated! I exhalt thee!
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Post by ironfang on Dec 12, 2005 23:47:31 GMT -5
Skathros and Maasenstodt raise valid points about support for T&T. Regardless as to whether Fiery Dragon and Flying Buffalo "officially" support the two in-print editions, there needs to be an outlet for supplements and adventures. I've said all along that if "they" can't/won't, "we" should. It took TSR 30 years and 3 owners before they gave up the ghost and published the OGL.
(Hello, Rick? You know I support you, but...)
As a first generation gamer, I'd love to see a hard-copy fanzine to go with the board and the current TROK - hard to read an online 'zine in the john, and not everyone has the opportunity to live online. But if it has to start online, please, somebody start the bloody thing! You know that the Vaults of Ironfang will be supporting you.
Please don't condemn the "pay for Trollhalla" site. Is it for everyone? Definitely not. Nor is it "elitist" - at least not in a bad way. I doubt any Champion thinks themselves better than any other T&T fan. Trollhalla serves a definite purpose in the T&T world - instrumental in getting 7th edition out there, providing funds for artwork and expenses, greasing wheels between fans and FBI. I don't look at the fees KSA asks for to be any different from the signing fees that are now mindlessly accepted at conventions worldwide. At least I get daily access to the Trollgod for my $20. If it's the $$$ that irk, well, there are a number of free-access living sites out there for T&T fans
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Post by maasenstodt on Dec 30, 2005 17:02:57 GMT -5
Thanks for the notice. I look forward to reading the work there, even though that will be more difficult given that the page doesn't render properly outside of Internet Explorer.
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Taran Dracon
1st Level Troll
I'm not a troll! I'm not a troll!!
Posts: 17
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Post by Taran Dracon on Dec 30, 2005 23:02:20 GMT -5
Hmmm... It loads ok for me in Firefox 1.0.7. You should upgrade to 1.5! In any case, it loads fine for me in Firefox. But on to the meat of the post. I have the first and only three published issues of Hobbit Hole, which Jim "that guy" helped to put together several years back. He had articles, reposts of selected posts from the BFT and OgrePit Yahoo! Groups, and art. Very well done. He had a falling out, I think, with some of the other editors/head honchos, and ended up publishing #4 on his own, but it was a rogue issue that he did by himself. Anybody else get or remember this? I think he sold it for $2.50 an issue.
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Taran Dracon
1st Level Troll
I'm not a troll! I'm not a troll!!
Posts: 17
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Post by Taran Dracon on Dec 31, 2005 0:19:23 GMT -5
You should upgrade to 1.5! In any case, it loads fine for me in Firefox. When I check for updates, Firefox claims there aren't any available... Yeah, the update feature doesn't work so well with the actual browser. It does ok with plugins. Anyway, just go to www.mozilla.com/firefox/ and download 1.5 from there!
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Post by maasenstodt on Jan 1, 2006 22:35:08 GMT -5
Hmmm... It loads ok for me in Firefox 1.0.7. It figures that soon after I upgrade to 1.5, I should run into this problem. Fortunately, however, the issue has been resolved. After some research, it seems that the extension "Adblock" can prevent Flash from rendering properly in 1.5. Such was the case with the Trollzine page. Uninstalling that extension and replacing it with "Adblock Plus" has fixed things, and I'm once again a happy camper.
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Taran Dracon
1st Level Troll
I'm not a troll! I'm not a troll!!
Posts: 17
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Post by Taran Dracon on Jan 4, 2006 8:23:22 GMT -5
Hmmm... It loads ok for me in Firefox 1.0.7. It figures that soon after I upgrade to 1.5, I should run into this problem. Fortunately, however, the issue has been resolved. After some research, it seems that the extension "Adblock" can prevent Flash from rendering properly in 1.5. Such was the case with the Trollzine page. Uninstalling that extension and replacing it with "Adblock Plus" has fixed things, and I'm once again a happy camper. I'm surprised you needed Adblock with Firefox. I haven't seen a pop up in many moons b/c Firefox has a setting you can click to stop pop ups. Starwars.com apparently is sneaky about them, inlining the ads into the window in some weird way--I guess it would be nice to not have those.
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