dalton
4th Level Troll
Posts: 282
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Post by dalton on Feb 15, 2007 11:06:19 GMT -5
Ok, Most of you have read what I am up to or have seen my work. But, here is a bit of a "State of the Insanity" report. 1.) I am an old time gamer, hate D20 and love the style of game that started this whole genre. 2.) I am a computer systems developer and a workaholic. 3.) I am certifiably insane - how else can you explain my even contemplating this idea. So, now that you guys know who I am, I can move forward with what I am going to be doing. I am going to be putting up a Wiki site, that will have an entire section dedicated to T&T. It will not have any of the original Wiki materials but, given that most of the original contributors are on this site, I am sure it will fill up quick. I have talked to Rick Loomis, Ken St. Andre and Jason Kempton (from Fiery Dragon). They are all open to the idea of the wiki and have given the go ahead. Jason has given me the permission to use 7th edition graphics to help decorate the site. Here is his exact response
Ok Dalton, you can use the interiors for your website - we just need a copyright www.fierydragon.com on it [thats easier to use than the full company name - the URL makes the point and gives the link at the same time]. It would be fair to credit the artist as well even though we own the copyright. For the cover it is Liz Danforth, all the interiors including the counters are Claudio Pozas. Keep it all web resolution! If you are up to making a much bigger monster manual for TnT then we can sell it as a PDF, branded under fiery dragon - we'll supply all the counter art and layout [the counters coming from our existing library] and you can take 40% of the revenue [revenue means the amount left over after the various eStores take their cut], if that's of interest to you. We could at any time ask you to remove all our copyright from your website. I am just stating this for due diligence. Take care, -jason
That means the new wiki will have the same look and feel as the 7th edition rules, as well as artwork that fits with the format. YEA! Now, he has followed up with 1800 images - that is a fair sized monster manual. Here are the questions - is there a market for this? Should it be set up as a single book? What details would people want to see? Also, the entire website is being written in a programming language called Morfik (www.morfik.com). That will allow me to completely port my graphic map programs to the web. It also allows me to create a site where end users can create their own solo adventures. It also allows me to work on over the web gaming materials. Forums, Blogs, Chats, Character generators........Yes I am going mad and just listing the possibilities, not the final products. Current hold ups are 1.) My ISP has not dropped off my router yet for this project 2.) My wife will kill me if I spend too much time on this project 3.) My wife will kill me if I spend too much money on this project. 4.) My wife will kill me if she finds out I am doing this project........ hmmmmm, I have to be nuts. How you guys can help 1.) Suggest a new site name. 2.) Tell me what you want from the site 3.) Tell me the products you want to see produced and we will see if they can be made for free or, have fiery dragon produce them. 4.) Don't tell my wife. So there it is, a bit of an update from a mad man. best regards Dalton
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Post by lionrampant on Feb 16, 2007 14:21:45 GMT -5
"3.) Tell me the products you want to see produced and we will see if they can be made for free or, have fiery dragon produce them."
I would be very interested in a spellbook, as well as a listing of monsters (see my own website for my interest in that, though since many of the ideas were stolen from the D&D Cyclopedia, I don't think they would be viable for your wiki due to Hasbro's IP ownership). I would also be willing to pitch in some monsters and spells to such a project, though I don't have a ton of ideas in my head right now.
If we were to do such a thing, I would recommend having some sort of "playtest area" where preliminary ideas could be submitted for people to try out, with the knowledge that these ideas are in "alpha"or "beta" stage. That way we could get more people involved in getting things balanced properly.
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dalton
4th Level Troll
Posts: 282
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Post by dalton on Feb 16, 2007 15:11:34 GMT -5
Hi Lionrampant
I am going to be making a spellbook on the site. The idea of the monster manual was my asking Jason permission to create a fan produced monster manual and he likes the idea enough to support the final sale of a hard copy or pdf of the final work.
The wiki will be a little different in that it will have both a free-form format area and a formated info area. The truth is, when someone enters a monster, piece of equipment or a spell, it will be entered into a database automatically (I am still figuring out what fields will be needed). Then, those items can be used within a new version of the combat simulator.
In this way, people can playtest the items immediately and see the results without needing a playgroup. I am hoping that the system gets versitile enough that you can create solo adventures online and play them immediately.
Rick responded to my request to use artwork scanned from older editions and he said the following
I just recieved the artwork from Fiery Dragon so we will have alot of material to make this a very good resource site for the users.
Best Regards
Dalton
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Post by Mhegrrrim Skulltosser on Feb 17, 2007 16:20:04 GMT -5
I exhalt your efforts Dalton. It is exciting to contemplate a new T&T Wiki! Ok, How you guys can help 1.) Suggest a new site name. 2.) Tell me what you want from the site 3.) Tell me the products you want to see produced and we will see if they can be made for free or, have fiery dragon produce them. 4.) Don't tell my wife. 1) Delver's Guide to Tunnels & Trolls 2) You should have a user login requirement. That way people must ask to join AND you can quickly catch and stop vandals. Destructive people hurt Giles's Wiki too much. He did an awesome job creating a place for T&Ters, but also had to spend too much time fixing the site from vandals. 3) I am happiest to see the site build up first, and then explore the need for products. 7th ed was a touch rushed, and I would be saddened to see more T&T products rushed to market without proper editing. If you do anything will spell books, please do not just heap spells into one spell book. I do not want to see a huge book of spells ordered only by Level. In the 80's Ken talked in an interview about having Kindred Specific Magic and that T&T's current spellbook was just Man's Magic. 7th ed expanded spells and included what guilds a spell can be purchased from. This was interesting, but strange when using "Wizards start with all Level 1 Spells". It would be great to see the above two concepts ordered into separate booklets. Ex: Wizards' Guild, Healers' Guild, A Book of Summonings, War Magic, Orc Shaman Magic, Dwarf Magic, Faerie Magic, and I can keep going. I would even love to contribute to an Art of Magic booklet. 4) Whispering, "I'll do my best to be quiet."
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dalton
4th Level Troll
Posts: 282
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Post by dalton on Feb 17, 2007 23:15:00 GMT -5
If you do anything will spell books, please do not just heap spells into one spell book. I do not want to see a huge book of spells ordered only by Level. In the 80's Ken talked in an interview about having Kindred Specific Magic and that T&T's current spellbook was just Man's Magic. 7th ed expanded spells and included what guilds a spell can be purchased from. This was interesting, but strange when using "Wizards start with all Level 1 Spells". It would be great to see the above two concepts ordered into separate booklets. Ex: Wizards' Guild, Healers' Guild, A Book of Summonings, War Magic, Orc Shaman Magic, Dwarf Magic, Faerie Magic, and I can keep going. I would even love to contribute to an Art of Magic booklet. Hi Talonfire, It is hard to come up with spells for T&T as any spell has to be easily used in a solitaire game without having the writer jump through hoops. I am thinking of different things, mostly from my own Shard Universe. In Shard, you have different classes of Spell Casters. The First Type uses their own Intellect and Willpower to shape the world to their own choosing - this is the standard T&T rogue and wizard. The Second Type captures magical beings (spirits) who are trapped until they are released upon the casting of the spell. This costs no wiz or strength, but, it does mean that the strength, type and number of spells are fixed before the delvers enter the adventure. This is very much in homage to the AD&D type wizard. The Third Type is a channeler who restricts their own actions in different situations in order to attune themselves to another being of great power. The closer the attunement, the greater the chance the spell will work, but, the channeler has a much reduced repertoire of spells available and must act in a manner that allows them to stay focused to the being providing the spell. This would be like the followers of Khazan or the Death Goddess to siphon off their powers for their own use. It is effectively clerical powers. I also see two different classes of spells, those that work within combat and those that work outside of combat. This distinction is for the use of magic matrix's and other such solo tools. Now, for different kindred and races, spells could occur at different levels or not appear at all. Overall it is a subject that is open to alot of discussion, and I expect that the wiki will get alot of work over this area. I do not want to produce a spell book like the Gurps book of magic or the D20 books. I want spell books that give story depth and ease of play. best regards Dalton
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khaydhaik
4th Level Troll
Thumb up!
Posts: 412
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Post by khaydhaik on Feb 21, 2007 2:19:15 GMT -5
2) You should have a user login requirement. That way people must ask to join AND you can quickly catch and stop vandals. Destructive people hurt Giles's Wiki too much. He did an awesome job creating a place for T&Ters, but also had to spend too much time fixing the site from vandals. The login requirement should only be for posting. Anyone should be allowed to read the wiki entries without logging in. This could help to entice lurkers to become posting members. To reduce the number of spammers that attempt to join the wiki as posting members, I'd suggest that all potential posting members be asked to provide a paragraph about their interests in the wiki, and to provide a valid email address, to which you'd be able to send confirmation of membership or follow-up questions. Someone only interested in spamming the wiki will likely be spotted from their write-up about their interests in the wiki. Moreover, spammers typically don't want to give out a valid email address. (I've stopped spammers using these two techniques in tandem on a small forum I run.) Just make sure you state in the privacy policy for the site that the email address will not be displayed and will not be used except to contact the member about the wiki. (This includes but is not limited to making sure you don't create "mailto:" links with the member's email address attached.) And make sure you don't display anything about a potential posting member on any web page until after membership has been approved. If a spammer can get a link to his site to show up on the wiki without having to become an approved member, then you can still have a problem with spammers.
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Post by branderwydd /|\ on Feb 21, 2007 10:23:57 GMT -5
"In the 80's Ken talked in an interview about having Kindred Specific Magic and that T&T's current spellbook was just Man's Magic."
talonfire~ in the monsters! monsters! book, there is the beginnings of this. enough to get you thinking, anyway.
in my homebrew world of catalyst, which is heavily lejentia influenced, monsters are rare, but there is a lot of diversity amongst a small number of kindreds. for instance, the true masters of magic are the dargonaths, of which there are 18 clans. each specializes in its own type of magic in addition to the standard magic all wizards get in the T&T rulebook. likewise for the elves, demons, black witches, etc. not exactly what you are referring to, but the same general concept. i have created many different 'schools' of magic to represent this, and after scouring T&T products and the 'net for many years, i've divivided all of these 'non-official' spells into the various schools, only accessed by the appropriate group.
still, i'm very eager to see how others have done this, especially with alien magics that only a monster's mind could dream up. so, i would be very interested in seeing a part of the wiki that reflects this.
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order99
7th Level Troll
Coffee-fueled Carrion That Walks Like a Man
Posts: 1,039
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Post by order99 on Feb 22, 2007 4:41:47 GMT -5
Hmmmm...names? Dalton's Delving Academy sounds pretty decent(and gives proper credit)...though I have to admit, Don't Tell the Wife might be good for a laugh(but get some really WEIRD Google results) An Exalt for your hard work , and best of luck.
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emryys
2nd Level Troll
Troll Spy
Posts: 56
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Post by emryys on Mar 31, 2007 1:01:06 GMT -5
Any news...? Between T&T, Traveller and DungeonForge... Do you get to sleep Mr Dalton... *If not come join us for an online game...!
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rpguru
1st Level Troll
Posts: 48
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Post by rpguru on Mar 31, 2007 8:37:43 GMT -5
Call it Trollvana
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rpguru
1st Level Troll
Posts: 48
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Post by rpguru on Mar 31, 2007 9:45:25 GMT -5
I had an idea. How about a wiki solo adventure, written by everyone that logs on. You can not only play it but also expand the wiki with other rooms? Sort of like the Hoppit project found at: www.thehoppit.net/
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dalton
4th Level Troll
Posts: 282
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Post by dalton on Mar 31, 2007 20:36:30 GMT -5
Any news...? Between T&T, Traveller and DungeonForge... Do you get to sleep Mr Dalton... *If not come join us for an online game...! Hey Emryys I have been swamped with a new project. While working on the web site, I sent an email to Jason at Fiery Dragon, asking for permission to use his graphics for the wiki. He said yes, and offered me a good deal if I create a monster manual for T&T. So, I started on my monster manual, but I could not stand the fiery dragon graphics, as they are too comic book like for my tastes. I also wanted something that was totally different from the typical fair that every other publisher created. As I have a extreamly good job, I am not doing this out of a monetary need, but out of love. Always a horrible reason for doing the work as you work ten times harder with a drive beyond most sane peoples expectations. I have stopped all web site development until my current project is finished. I have stopped all DungeonForge developement until my current project is finished. I have purchased over $1,800 in stock graphics, as well as having a professional graphic artist and writer join me on the project. The project has grown and I have no expectation that Jason will accept the final work, and as such I have no expectation that the project will ever see the light of day. So far, I have the statistics for 247 creatures. I have the complete writeups for 74 creatures. They are all specific to Shard vs Trollworld as I will not use any creature or location from Trollworld - I am not going to infringe upon Ken's copyright. I am using T&T 7th edition rules. The current book mockups are looking very good, but final page layout has not been finalized. The look and style is very similiar to the book of Kells. Overall, I figure I have another two months of work before it is finished. So, I have no time for online play, although I do play T&T twice a week to playtest what I am creating. I am thinking of restarting my Thread that details my game world, so that only the latest material is in that thread - the one that is currently hosted here has multiple variations of rules as the evolution of the sytem has occured. Best regards Dalton
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Post by Mhegrrrim Skulltosser on Apr 9, 2007 23:27:43 GMT -5
Well Dalton, I hope you don't get too many brands in the fire. You've created a lot of interesting ideas on this site. I look forward to seeing more. I worked a lot on Giles' Wiki, and would happily continue contributing to a new wiki.
In the mean time, I will continue to keep busy with the random submission to Hobbit Hole and my work with Dungeonier Digest.
The trick with a "Monster Manual" is to avoid looking like D&D. That would be terrible. A T&T "Monster Manual" needs something different. Have you checked out the series of "ology" books: Dragonology, Goblinology, Egyptology, Wizardology, or Pirateology. Something similar to these books would be fun to purchase. You know include game material and mix in enough fun stuff for the non-gamer.
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dalton
4th Level Troll
Posts: 282
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Post by dalton on May 18, 2007 14:33:02 GMT -5
Well,
It has been awhile, since I updated anyone.
I finished 230 monsters for the T&T monster project, but Jason has not responded to my emails and Ken tells me to stay away from the politics so I have shelved that project.
I have created 20 new character races, updated my own house rules and I have been producing maps for shard, but I have actually been using my hosting machine for actually making money, so I have not put anything out on the web.
I have posted a bit of the fiction I was writing as it was the basis for my sci-fi setting for traveller. It is very dark but it was written as a story of redemption where none of the main characters are heroes by any stretch of the imagination. If people want to read it all, let me know and I will see if I can find the rest of the story to post (it has been awhile since I looked at it).
best regards
Dalton
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Post by Mhegrrrim Skulltosser on May 27, 2007 11:07:39 GMT -5
Wow! Dalton, you have enough material for every player to play a different kindred. How are you grouping your new monsters and kindreds? With so many, I imagine alphabetically might be a little formitable to the casual eye.
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