Ea
2nd Level Troll
Posts: 62
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Post by Ea on Feb 8, 2010 15:37:41 GMT -5
Some people never learn... more stuff for the lawyers I guess. the-hobbit-hole.angelfire.com/Can't miss all the fake rights listed on the website, or the fact that most products there are written by either Ken St. Andre or Andy R. Holmes--and are being published without permission.
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quoghmyre
7th Level Troll
The Summer Troll
Posts: 1,048
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Post by quoghmyre on Feb 8, 2010 16:00:58 GMT -5
We realise that mahrundl, not getting at you. It was just an observation that sometimes our language sugar coats a situation. One of the great things of RPG is that we get to do things we would never do in RL. Climb mountains, stealing, even murder, and we have a shorthand vocab that allows these things.
In our games it's perfectly ok for a Black Hobbit or Rogue to do things which would never be acceptable in real life. I would go as far as to say we would applaud the tricksy and devious actions, in game, but in RL we are horrified. I wonder if Mr "that guy" hasn't lost his way when it comes to this very point.
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Post by karluush on Feb 8, 2010 18:09:35 GMT -5
Maybe someone should send Angelfire an email telling them about their latest addition? I would, but I'd have to find a few places that centralize all the stuff "that guy" has done.
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eegah
1st Level Troll
Posts: 19
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Post by eegah on Feb 14, 2010 22:32:01 GMT -5
This might not even be important but I was reading my 7.5 books again and I see that the Codex Incantatem is used under license by FDP and copyright Mr. "that guy". I would imagine that in the future FDP is probably not going to want to be associated with "that company" products. Both 7.5 box sets have "that company" stuff in the extra books. Has anybody heard anything about the future of 7.5 products?
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Post by mgtremaine on Feb 14, 2010 22:55:52 GMT -5
Maybe someone should send Angelfire an email telling them about their latest addition? I would, but I'd have to find a few places that centralize all the stuff "that guy" has done. Seems like that happend already the site is now gone, replace by a term of service violation. Ahh -Mike
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machfront
11th level Troll
Stalwart of the Trollbridge
"Let's go dark!"
Posts: 2,147
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Post by machfront on Feb 15, 2010 5:55:35 GMT -5
This might not even be important but I was reading my 7.5 books again and I see that the Codex Incantatem is used under license by FDP and copyright Mr. "that guy". I would imagine that in the future FDP is probably not going to want to be associated with "that company" products. Both 7.5 box sets have "that company" stuff in the extra books. Has anybody heard anything about the future of 7.5 products? I've zero knowledge of the future of T&T as it relates to FDP, but, in the massive thread on RPG.net...somewhere in there...if I recall correctly, someone quoted one of the fellows from FDP saying how very disappointed he was in "that guy"'s actions and was essentially embarrassed to have OP products in 7.5 and the Delver's Pack. He further stated that they would not work with "that guy" in the future.
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eegah
1st Level Troll
Posts: 19
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Post by eegah on Feb 16, 2010 0:16:56 GMT -5
Makes sense that FDP would not work with him anymore. I hope that it does not stop them from making new T&T products. I know 7.5 is not everybody's favorite but it is the current stuff. I actually like the small size books but not the spiral binding. I would have liked to have seen a book with 7.5 and Delver's all in one big book but that seems impossible now.
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Hogscape
11th level Troll
Stalwart of the Trollbridge
It's not the years, it's the mileage.
Posts: 2,126
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Post by Hogscape on Feb 16, 2010 3:05:40 GMT -5
Hmmm, if FDP were only printing OP material... The future looks a little gloomy.
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eegah
1st Level Troll
Posts: 19
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Post by eegah on Mar 10, 2010 1:55:25 GMT -5
OP stuff is showing up on amazon.com so this guy will obviously not stop with his material. I can only wonder if all the buzz might actually increase his sales for a while.
What I am really wondering about all of this is what Fiery Dragon Press will do with future 7.5 material.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Mar 22, 2010 21:01:59 GMT -5
Yeah, I bought two books on Amazon, thinking that issues had been resolved because of the recent dates on the books. Then I wrote Ken and was really embarrassed for having supported OP.
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quoghmyre
7th Level Troll
The Summer Troll
Posts: 1,048
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Post by quoghmyre on Mar 23, 2010 0:32:39 GMT -5
I'm sure many are still falling for his wiles. Many of us have but now we know better.
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andrew
3rd Level Troll
Posts: 110
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Post by andrew on Mar 23, 2010 7:12:19 GMT -5
The words '"that company"' and '"that guy"' should be a pariah to everyone now and forever. He's stolen art, stolen IP, and boasts for having done so. Shouldn't that be enough to dissuade anyone from wanting anything he produces?
Today, I went to Lulu and read the following Preview for the book "Goblins in the Mists." This blurb can be found, ironically enough, on the copyright page:
This "Goblin in the Mists" fanpostal (TM) book is a tribute to Tunnels and Trolls, originally written by Ken St. Andre (after being copied from D&D) and now owned by Flying Buffalo, Inc. These settings may be used with Tunnels and Trolls or with any other game system. The word 'Tunnels and Trolls' is not trademarked. You can also confirm this by checking with the Library of Congress.
Grammar errors aside, it appears he's openly challenging Flying Buffalo's trademark, and accusing Ken St. Andre of plagirism. "that guy" is a joke. Is there any reason to do business with this guy today, or at any point in the future? No.
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machfront
11th level Troll
Stalwart of the Trollbridge
"Let's go dark!"
Posts: 2,147
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Post by machfront on Mar 24, 2010 17:29:54 GMT -5
Ha ha ha ha ha!! Wow. That blurb. What a...you-know-what. It's sorta like a four-year-old stamping his foot and insisting he's right.
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ishtar
2nd Level Troll
Posts: 74
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Post by ishtar on Mar 25, 2010 16:35:38 GMT -5
This "Goblin in the Mists" fanpostal (TM) book is a tribute to Tunnels and Trolls, originally written by Ken St. Andre (after being copied from D&D) and now owned by Flying Buffalo, Inc. These settings may be used with Tunnels and Trolls or with any other game system. The word 'Tunnels and Trolls' is not trademarked. You can also confirm this by checking with the Library of Congress.Grammar errors aside, it appears he's openly challenging Flying Buffalo's trademark, and accusing Ken St. Andre of plagirism. "that guy" is a joke. Is there any reason to do business with this guy today, or at any point in the future? No. Oy. Trademarks aren't registered with the Library of Congress. Trademarks are registered with the U.S. Patent & Trademark Office. (This is what I do for a living ...) That said, I went to the PTO site and checked out Tunnels & Trolls for trademarks and discovered an abandoned application by Flying Buffalo back in 1980, and a registration by New World Computing that was cancelled in 1998. So there is not currently a trademark registration for T&T, that's true. (FBI or FD or Ken or somebody ought to register it again. However, the copyright is still valid and will remain so for seventy years after Ken's death. So there's a potential for copyright infringement here, and if anything in "that guy"'s work specifically draws on Ken's, then Ken would own the derivative copyright, not "that guy".
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quoghmyre
7th Level Troll
The Summer Troll
Posts: 1,048
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Post by quoghmyre on Mar 25, 2010 17:55:33 GMT -5
There's been a lot of discussion around the trademark and copyright, those registrations were in place for the T&T software projects, I think. The point that's been made is that, just because you can get away with it and it's in the grey area of illegal, should you do it? "that guy" has been asked/told repeatedly to stop reselling T&T products, by both Ken, Rick and his other contributors, yet he persists.
I have 2 products I'd love to release but in the current situation where a person is stealing anything that is mildly successful and related to T&T, it's not going to happen, my boss just isn't going to fund the release.
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